> > This is about the dumbest rear wing I ever saw on a race car.
 > > It is socially irresponsible on the basis of excess fuel consumption
 > > alone.
 > >
 > > Down force to drag ratio, in this application, is mostly
 > > a function of the span loading. That is why sail planes have long
 > > wings. Cl squared over Pi times the aspect ratio! The aspect ratio
 > > here is about one!
 > >
 > > Let assume the Cl is 2. the induced drag factor is
 > > then four divided by Pi or about 1.25! In other words for every
 > > pound of down force there is about 1.25 pounds of DRAG!!!!!
 > >
 > > This will do nothing to reduce the turbulence behind the car. It will
 > > probably increase it. The Formula 1 aerodynamicist are now complaining
 > > they can not get enough down force on the nose because the front wing
 > > is affected by the tires and the body. Face facts FIA. allow wide high
 > > mounted wings both front and rear.
 > >
 > > I don't know what, if anything, the FIA is thinking.
 > > Don't they have anybody on their staff that can explain
 > > this to them? Not all people watching Formula 1 are stupid.
 > >
 > > Check out the old suspension mounted high wing movies on
 > > www.rotaryeng.net <http://www.rotaryeng.net>. Scrol down to the bottom
 > > of the first page.
 > >
 > >
 > > Paul Lamar
 >
 > ---------------------------------------------------------------
 >
 > NOVEMBER 21, 2008
 >
 >
 > Overtaking is easier!
 >
 > The new Formula 1 cars of 2009 may look a bit odd at the moment and the
 > front wings may be ugly, but the first impressions from the drivers are
 > that the new aerodynamic rules that have been devised by the Overtaking
 > Working Group will make it easy for them to race. BMW Sauber test driver
 > Christian Klien says that it is now easier to get closer to the car in
 > front because of the reduction in turbulence created by the smaller rear
 > wings. In addition the wider front wings mean that the front end of the
 > following car is more stable and so a driver has more confidence that he
 > can make a move.
 >
 > BMW is now planning to "race" two of its modified cars at the next test
 > in Jerez to see whether the theory has become a reality...
 >
 > Klien says that the looks of the cars is really not important.
 >
 > "Beauty and elegance are pretty important for a road car," he says. "In
 > racing, only speed counts."
 >
 > Pete Lyons.
 >
 >
 >
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 >
 > I have no doubt it is easier to pass. Do we want a just a driver
circus or real
 > auto racing where the design of the car matters? Is the efficient
design of a
 > race car important in the context of fuel burn? You betcha. Let the
drivers
 > compete in a down hill ski race.
 >
 > However the down force to drag ratio of this rear wing may be so bad
that some
 > track's lap times will be lower without this wing if the FIA allows
the teams
 > to run without it. Of course they would still have some down force on
the rear
 > from the belly pan diffuser.
 >
 > The questions are; did the FIA look at other alternatives? Is the
turbulence
 > less than a high mounted, full car width wing, with the same down
force and with
 > a better down force to drag ratio? I don't think so.
 >
 > John Iley told me they were NOT getting enough down force on the
current front
 > wing. Why not go back to a small high mounted front wing as well. We
used one on
 > Ron Grable's ASD American Mk1-Chevrolet V8 #4 Williams Racing (US) at
the 1969
 > Mid Ohio Formual A race where Ron qualified second to Sam Posey. The
drag may be
 > less than the current front wing.
 >
 > Ron, If you don't mind could you comment on this race and how the
high front
 > mounted wing worked out? Also if you have an pictures of this car showing
 > the front wing I would love to have them.
 >
 > Give the engineers a bit more creative freedom and you will see
plenty of
 > passing. You will see that anyway this year with KERS. If truly free
some KERS
 > schemes will be better than others.
 >
 > Also there is something I don't understand. Why does the Formula 1
community
 > need the FIA anyway?
 >
 > Paul Lamar
 > --

---------------------------------------------------------

Paul,
 From the dusty corners of my memory, I recall the American car was well
balanced at Mid Ohio, and even in the long hairpin leading onto the
straightaway (where understeer is usually a problem) the hi-mounted
front wing planted the front very well.  Attached is one pic I could
find showing the Lamar front/rear wings, at Edmonton, Alberta, 1971.
Ron

-------------------------------------------------
Great picture Ron. Thanks

This was taken after the FIA banned suspension mounted wings.
As I recall this wing was mounted on the front suspension
in Mid Ohio. I believe this was the first high mounted front
wing car.

Paul Lamar