What do all you guys think of converting my RV4 to tricycle gear?
I have been told to wheel land it at 80 MPH.
That is a field length penalty and a much worse crash if you screw
up.
As I understand it they are dangerous in cross wind landings. I have
a friend with one that refuses to fly under sever cross wind
conditions.
Paul Lamar
It's not the beginning of April already is it ?
John
No john I am serious. I have already spent $1000 with some jerk up
in Oregon trying to teach me to wheel land at 80 MPH.
Actually most of the time was spent doing 360's just under the
overcast and just above the trees like I needed to do that :)
When a tail wheel airplane first touches a paved runway with any
cross wind component at all the side force is ahead of the CG and by
any definition that is severe instability.
Tails wheels were designed back in the days when dirt air fields were
2 miles square and you could always land into the wind. Also the
coefficient of friction of rubber tires on dirt or grass is much
less than on pavement.
I don't want to be put in position of either running out of gas or
landing in a cross wind with a tail wheel.
Paul Lamar
I learned to fly on a C120 and loved it. That one you could wheel
land or 3 point land. The 3 pointer landing actually happened in a
fairly short distance as we were taught to try and touch the
tailwheel down 1 second before the mains so you didn't touch mains
first and set up a bounce. Worked like a charm and its the same
technique as landing the tricycle just that you hold it off a bit
higher and a bit longer. Touchdown speed was lower than a wheeler
landing due to the high angle of attack at touchdown. Are you not
supposed to 3 point land a RV4? All serious short field planes with
tail dragged config seem to be able to land in a reasonably short
distance so I guess they 3 point land it,
Alex
Touching down on a locked tail wheel should work great. Maybe I
should focus on finding or making a locking tail wheel.
Paul Lamar
Dear Mr. Lamar:
I would check with the Kit manufacturer and ask IF they have any
information regarding landing a Tricycle Gear RV4 in crosswinds. As
they offer a Tricycle Gear option, they should have a chart or
information about how it handles in crosswind landings, etc. that
should be in the aircraft manual.
I would also ask the Kit manufacturer IF they could send you the name
and addresses of several of their customers that have and fly a Tri
Gear RV-4s. I would contact those individuals. I am sure Tri Gear
RV-4 owners and operators could give you a lot of information based
on experience how the Tri Gear RV-4 handles in cross winds.
I would also check on installing Vortrice Generators on your
airplanes wings and tail to improve handling of your ariplane at low
speeds.
All My Best
Brannen Sanders
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=29562
"The 8 has a larger rudder and longer fuselage and stiffer gear, is
heavier with different crosswind manners. To answer your question, in
my RV4 I used 20 knots max direct cross using a wheels landing, wing
low on touchdown technique. Any more and it's gets squirrley when you
lower the tail as the fuselage blanks alot of the rudder.The Rocket
with an RV4 rudder is even more pronounced. Most production
taildraggers use 17 knots direct crosswind as a limit. I asked a FSDO
guy once about that and he said that years ago all of the
manufacturers got together and agreed on a number, the insurance
companies liked it and there it was, 17 knots. Your mileage may
vary..."
"Rob Ray 1500 Hours RV4 HR2"
So apparently the rudder is blanked and that is why they insist on
wheel landings.
Back to nose gear :)
Paul Lamar
If I remember correctly wheel landings were done only a few MPH
faster than full stall landings. Used to get good control with rudder
and aileron, perhaps one brake in a cross wind. People that do it, do
it all of the time. Just to keep a keen edge on that tool. If you
cannot stay on the centerline during approach with bank and rudder,
you need to use a different runway, or airport.
You are not landing at 80 MPH. You are flying across an airport with
the wheels on the ground. That would be a low pass. Just get in some
slow time in a Champ or Cub and an old instructor. You just cannot
beat conventional gear for getting in and out of short fields.
I got stuck out in a cross wind and low on fuel over a paved airport
that had gas. I could not stay over the runway in my BC12D, so I
landed on the turn around circle at the end right into the stiff
wind. A couple of boys came out and clipped a rope into the tie down
ring on the right wing and walked me to the fuel pumps.
Lynn E. Hanover
The airplane is finished and flying. Since the tail is blanked at 3
point landing angles of attack perhaps vortex generators on the
canopy and fuselage sides would help.
A larger rudder with more area at the bottom would also help. The
rudder is structurally weak anyway and prone to flutter at speeds
over 200 MPH. We considered making a new balanced one out of carbon
fiber to stop that. The stock RV4 rudder is not balanced. The
balanced part at the top would help.
Van should be doing this.
A tall wheel faring that looks like a rudder would also help.
Paul Lamar
Hi Paul
Lay up glass directly on the skuffed up alum rudder, then carbon on top
of that, also put
the weight in the redone fiberglass tip (ie) RV7.
Ben Lane
Sounds a little heavy. I was thinking of a female mold and vacuum bag. I
have a good vacuum pump.
I also want to add area to solve the fuse blanking problem. I think it
will fit the RV6 as well
so Dave Leonard can go faster :)
It is not good that the rudder and vertical stab are blanked in a stall.
You are asking for a spin.
Paul Lamar
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