Subject: definition of detonation.
From: paul lamar
Date: 9/6/2017, 12:32 PM
To: A10-Me-Earthlink




    "Detonation" is the spontaneous ignition of the fuel air mixture. This
    occurs after the planned ignition event and usually at a location
remote
    from the spark plugs. So, mixture temperature is usually to blame. So,
    the use of intake air coolers and intercoolers on super charged and or
    turbo charged engines. In order to reduce intake air temperatures.
Also,
    additional fuel my be added to help reduce charge temperature.Also,
    lower compression rotors or pistons may be used.  Also ignition advance
    may be pulled out as boost is going up. Flame front speed is largely a
    function of cylinder pressure.
    So, the higher the cylinder pressure, the faster the burn, and less
    advance is needed to get best cylinder pressure near 50 degrees after
    TDC. Ceramic seals hold up well to detonation. Steel seals and carbon
    seals do not.

    "Preignition", is an ignition event that occurs before the planned
    ignition event. Unlike detonation, it often occurs at or near the spark
    plugs. Usually too high a heat range (plug tip overheats and becomes a
    glow plug). Running the ideal mixture for best power is very popular.
    However with best power comes highest cylinder temperatures and the
    least amount of cooling oil. When leaning to lean of peak operation,
    move quickly through ideal and get to lean. The more powerful the
    ignition system the leaner it will run without missing. Faulty
    distributor cap, plug wires too close together. Primary wires not
    shielded from secondary wires. Solid conductor secondary wire (Use
    inductive secondary wires in most cases).

    You can induce both problems at one time.

    One outstanding feature of the ceramic and the carbon seals is that
they
    weight nothing compared to steel seals.So, they will track the chrome
    well up into stupid RPM. For above stupid RPM, multiple springs can be
    installed with still no chrome damage.  Also there is just a one piece
    seal, so no pesky corner piece to overload one iron face. Carbon and
    ceramic seals must be fitted to each housing using a diamond file.
Check
    with supplier for specs.
    With both carbon and ceramic seals after years of racing show no
wear at
    all on chrome faces. Ceramic seals stay as new and carbons last about 2
    years.

    Lynn E. Hanover


    This is a piston engine Lynn. What is the source for this definition.

    I would say for an aircraft engine the extra cost of Iannetti apex
seals
    is essential.
    For turbo charged Mazda Wankel the iron seals are marginal.
    Steels seal are not to be used if you expect your engine to last.


    Paul Lamar

    Lynn,

    What material are you referring to citing 'carbon' for apex seals.
We know ceramics, steel and cast iron.
    It could not be plain carbon. It has to be reinforced with
something to prevent breakage and also wear.

    Please elaborate what you are referring to and who makes and sells
carbon seals?
    I know that in Germany firms have tried to use carbon as piston
seals. It did not make
    it to mass production as far as I am aware of. I trust to much wear
was an issue. ?

    Thank you
    Rolf Pfeiffer

Mazda used carbon impregnated aluminum for a while. Light so it did not
cause chatter
marks on the rotor housing. They also were not hard on the chrome
housing  for wear.

Dale Davies


Yes Dale, I read about that too. 
I just wonder if any carbon based seals or a carbon compound is in use for apex seals today. 

Light weight also reduces the centrifugal force of the seals which, besides reducing or eliminating the
tendency to chatter is also beneficial for less wear and less friction.
So far it looks that silicon carbide is the best bet. I would love to use a carbon compound or such
as carbon has self lubricating properties. This may eliminate the need for oil supply to the Trochoide
and side housings. No fuel - oil mix would be needed if carbon could be used. However, a bit of oil
also supports a better gas seal. Small amounts of oil would still be beneficial. 

Rolf Pfeiffer 




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